Chess Database

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Re: Chess Database

Post by Chess? on April 18th 2009, 12:15 pm

Chess data base. What is everyone using? I am using the Chessbase light 2007. But its piss-in me off. I can't save positions the search is limited. I guess for a free “light” data base it’s not bad.
To buy the ChessBase 10 starter it is $219.00 cdn, before taxes and shipping. For one, that is a lot of dough and the other I am not sure if I need it? The other is my experience with Chessbase software is that it is not that user friendly. It can do an amazing amount of tasks it you have the time to work with the not so friendly help menu’s.
Is there something out there that is easy to use and affordable?
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Re: Chess Database

Post by fanat on April 18th 2009, 1:07 pm

Chess? wrote:Chess data base. What is everyone using? I am using the Chessbase light 2007. But its piss-in me off. I can't save positions the search is limited. I guess for a free “light” data base it’s not bad.
To buy the ChessBase 10 starter it is $219.00 cdn, before taxes and shipping. For one, that is a lot of dough and the other I am not sure if I need it? The other is my experience with Chessbase software is that it is not that user friendly. It can do an amazing amount of tasks it you have the time to work with the not so friendly help menu’s.
Is there something out there that is easy to use and affordable?

There might be a way to modify light edition to make it a full version so you will be able to save the games and not limit searches or work with more than 24K games per database. PM me if you need more info.

Chessbase is very flexible and you can save your notes. This is the main advantage and it seems that everybody is using it.
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Re: Chess Database

Post by Blue Devil Knight on April 18th 2009, 11:52 pm

ChessDB is free and you can download a database of 3 million games with it:
http://chessdb.sourceforge.net/

I find it very helpful.
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Re: Chess Database

Post by Chess? on April 19th 2009, 10:57 am

Blue Devil Knight wrote:ChessDB is free and you can download a database of 3 million games with it:
http://chessdb.sourceforge.net/

I find it very helpful.

Thaks BDK I will give it a try.
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Re: Chess Database

Post by Kopperhed on April 20th 2009, 7:10 pm

I currently use Chessbase 10 for my main chess database program although I also own Chess Assistant 10. Another new program I've started using recently is Aquarium. Aquarium is a GUI for the Rybka 3 chess engine and has database functions similar to Chess Assistant in addition to analysis features.
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Re: Chess Database

Post by fanat on April 20th 2009, 8:06 pm

Kopperhed wrote:I currently use Chessbase 10 for my main chess database program although I also own Chess Assistant 10. Another new program I've started using recently is Aquarium. Aquarium is a GUI for the Rybka 3 chess engine and has database functions similar to Chess Assistant in addition to analysis features.

I've recently got Chess Assistant 10 but unfortunately didn't have a lot of time to figure it out completely.

Which is a better program to analyze your own games - CA10 or Aquarium in your opinion? I mean using the same Rybka 3 engine which program is easier to use and which program will give you better output with more variations?
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Re: Chess Database

Post by Kopperhed on April 20th 2009, 9:59 pm

I think Aquarium would do a better job at game analysis since it has the IDEA function.
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Re: Chess Database

Post by siva.uk75 on September 22nd 2010, 12:34 pm

Mm, few things i use are like the following.

1. Fritz12+with Deep Rybka
2. Chess base mega database 2010 (5 million games )
3. chessbaes light premium 2009 ( for creating database )
4. free games from internet which i have downloaded ( 2 million )
5. Arena
6. scid

Well, i have collected a lot but need to study a lot. Embarassed Evil or Very Mad monkey cheers cherry No

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Re: Chess Database

Post by BorgQueen on September 22nd 2010, 8:00 pm

Chessbase 9 Lite for now. I have never really had a database for chess, I haven't seen the point of it. Probably because I have Deep Fritz 11 (plus a whole load of other engines) which has a 'database' that I didn't see all that much use for but to get a few suggestions for the opening. I still haven't even run CB9 yet, I only downloaded it last night.

It is only after recently I noticed lots of people talking about ChessBase that got me curious, so I wanted to see what all the fuss is about.

The thing is WAAAAY too expensive to buy though. The whole idea is to get a big database, so the one with the biggest would cost me about $420AUD. That's an absurd amount of money. But I'd really like the CB10 Mega Pack.

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Re: Chess Database

Post by siva.uk75 on September 23rd 2010, 5:22 am

no need to buy atleast 2 milion good games you can find in internet in the links i have posted in other topics. Also, use SCID tool so that u can divide large databases ( PGN ) , to small 32000 files, and u are up and running CB light 9 ( CB light has 14000 games only ) ,

the main thing , if you are studying ICS material for openings, then u can find games which are played by grand masters using ECO code. for example A80 ( dutch defence ) for 1. d4.... queen pawn opening. bounce

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Re: Chess Database

Post by BorgQueen on September 23rd 2010, 8:49 am

Tempting to just get CB10 to avoid all the stuffing around with db size limits.

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Re: Chess Database

Post by siva.uk75 on September 23rd 2010, 8:54 am

well, if you are OK with PGN database e t c, then u can download 2 million games and download either SCID or ARENA software which are freewares and no limitation, 1.7 million games easily viewable either in SCID or ARENA software. ( both have engines too ) , free stock fish and deep rybyka 2.3. versions.

If you want only CBH format yes, u require CB light 2009 premium.

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Re: Chess Database

Post by PawnCustodian on September 23rd 2010, 3:37 pm

I use CA 10 and spend about 95% of my time with it. Got it because it was cheaper that CB.

The plusses are that it can import virtually any format. Supports any UCI engine, does all of the analysis functions from analyzing a complete database, individual game analysis, and a variety of postion analysis. It also supports engine tournaments which I have find to be useful frequently.

With a full-function database you can select games on virtually any criteria including chess query language (if you can figure it out). I have also built opening books from the games databases without any difficulty.

I import all of the ICS games into CA and convert the games to CA Base format and catalog all of my games and annotations. At some point I plan to join the games into the Hugebase for archiving.

I have Fritz and Shredder as my preferred playing interfaces, but that's just because they have more flexible playing user (playing) interfaces. I move my opening books into both from CA without difficulty. (Recently I started using Bookup software in the transition for it's training capabilities and ease of use in editing a large repertoire.)

I also have Aquarium. Basically it's only advantage is IdEA which is great for digging deeply into positons. I also prefer to use Aquarium for engine tournaments again only because I prefer the user interface.

In my experience a large number of games doesn't mean good. A good database program needs to be able to do game analysis to screen misleading game results. Peruse a large database and just look at games that end around the common time controls - you'll find a high frequency of games that end with blunders an/or winning positions that lost.

Bottom line is a fully functional database program like CB or CA that can do it all and have great long term value. After that return on investment drops quickly for other programs and bloated games databases.

(Did I just say I am an impulse shopper??)





Last edited by PawnCustodian on September 23rd 2010, 3:43 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : Added Bookup Notes)

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Re: Chess Database

Post by BorgQueen on September 23rd 2010, 7:55 pm

Interesting. Excellent point that a big database doesn't mean it's good. Blunders and games lost on time or even games played by patzers in a database isn't that useful I guess.

When I get time to fiddle I'll see what I can sus out.

Thanks!

And yup, you're an impulse shopper!

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Re: Chess Database

Post by PawnCustodian on September 24th 2010, 11:33 am

Well, don't get me wrong. The games are good, I just think that it is essential that a chess DB have automated tools to identify and help assemble a good game selection. There are even a number of games in the ICS selection this month with possibly outcome-changing blunders and yet the games are valuable just the same.

If you select and prune games games for errors (chaging results in some cases) for your repertoire for example, you will then be able to rely on the tree statistics. Something that you cannot do with the raw game data. (Obviously you would need to create a stand alone DB since it no longer reflects player history - but who cares so long as you know what it is for.)


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Re: Chess Database

Post by HangingKing on September 24th 2010, 12:08 pm

A good database must come with CQL in order to ease the search of games you are really interested in, else it's just a huge useless thing.

http://www.xs4all.nl/~timkr/chess2/cql.htm

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Re: Chess Database

Post by BorgQueen on September 24th 2010, 12:45 pm

Wow.... there is so much more to it than I first thought, that's for sure!

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Re: Chess Database

Post by PawnCustodian on September 24th 2010, 1:36 pm

HangingKing wrote:A good database must come with CQL in order to ease the search of games you are really interested in, else it's just a huge useless thing.

http://www.xs4all.nl/~timkr/chess2/cql.htm

You've earned my deepest respect!

I went through the manual and concluded that the pre-built queries were just fine (translation: CQL is just too hard for me to learn).

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Re: Chess Database

Post by HangingKing on September 24th 2010, 1:57 pm

Tim Krabbe in the given link wrote: As Costeff says, you have to be a little computer-savvy to use CQL - in fact, it's the most wonderful user-hostile program I've ever seen. The FAQ on Stiller's site starts with the question: Why is the manual so difficult to understand. (Answer: We're sorry about that! The manual is very terse.)

I do not use CQL myself, but online websites that have database server usually provide some standard queries (to search for players, openings and so on) that are not always sufficient.

I just wanted to give a pointer on this query language for those interested.
Also the link is 2004, maybe you should search for soemthing up to date, maybe they have made progress on the manual or there exists some beautiful GUI frontend to play with.


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Re: Chess Database

Post by PawnCustodian on September 24th 2010, 3:15 pm

I looked at CQL a couple of months ago and found nothing new on the web.

If someone wants to get smart with CQL it looks as if the best source is in inside DB software. For example in CA you can open up the CQL subdirectory with a text editor and find 161 pre-built queries to study. Believe it or not the code is actually commented!

With so much capabilty already built in it would take some pretty compelling reason to actually take the time to learn to build up queries from scratch.

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